Something I would NEVER want TO SEE

I was going to respond, and then decided not to feed the trolls. The more we feed them the more we encourage them, and my post would only encourage this tiring drama. You know, as well as everyone else here, that this person is not named Sam Adams and that this post is only intended to rile up some of the members here.

Kelle, it is tiring having trolls on the board. It disrupts the forum and I am sick of the drama. I used to respond to this crap thinking that you could reason with these people but it just isn't worth it anymore. Sick people cannot be reasoned with, as we have all learned.

If you or anyone else wants to encourage them by responding to them then be my guest and that is your choice, but I am not going to post to trolls and those that only come here to stir the pot and hide behind fake names. It's detrimental to the forum and I don't think that this forum needs any more drama than it already has.

Your right it's disruptive. However, regardless of if they are named Sam, Tom, Dick or Harry....if there were even an ounce of truth to what they are claiming then the natural response from those of us that replied is out of concern. So I hope this isn't your way of scolding those who chose to reply.

What I don't understand is why not just kill the rumors? Not that they owe anyone any sort of explaination but these accusations have been made repeatedly and the responses from the person is one of defense instead of simply saying "No I don't have 20+ dogs I have _________. and here are pictures of my home/dogs set up". One would think it would be so much easier and less tiring to just shut these people up about it once and for all. And perhaps the disruptiveness and drama on this particular topic would have a much higher chance of coming to a halt. But since they don't do that people are going to continue to wonder if there is indeed any truth to it.

Kelle,


these accusations are being directed at Amber..Again. I have been to her home, stayed there last Dec for the Euk invitational. 4 days I was there, and not a stacked crate to be seen. No, there wasn't 20 dogs either. These people have NEVER been there, so who should you believe?

Kelle,


these accusations are being directed at Amber..Again. I have been to her home, stayed there last Dec for the Euk invitational. 4 days I was there, and not a stacked crate to be seen. No, there wasn't 20 dogs either. These people have NEVER been there, so who should you believe?

Carla,

And you've never questioned why that is?? Do you simply believe that she is a innocent target? I don't pretend to have any love for her but there are reasons for that. I can't respect someone that, from what I've seen twists the truth in her own defense. Not to rehash an old topic but as an example; do you remember the picture of her on the Jimtown kennels website holding a grey pug? But yet she claimed she didn't buy the puppy? The timing appeared to coincide with her "study" of the genetics of silver greys. Was she just visiting and they happened to take a picture of her and place it on their puppy buyer page? And there is alot of other questionable circumstances where she's dodged giving straight answers and rather is secretive and elusive about them. I would think that you would understand why some people that do not know her like you do, would wonder about these things? It would be human nature to do so.

I know she's your BFF so ofcourse it's your job as her best friend to come to her defense. And I have no issues with you Carla, nor am I hell bent on attacking her. But I'm not going to be scolded by her either for replying to a post. And that is how her reply came across to me.

Unfortunately, the masses may not just take your word for it Carla and I bet there are many here who are curious as to why she herself has never stated how many Pugs and Bulldogs she has and has never (that I have seen) posted photos of her set up. Seems that would be an easy cure to these rumors. Maybe I'm just too much of an open book and she and I simply operate on total opposites of the spectrum. No, she's not obligated to do that but she can't keep complaining that she's the victim and a target if she chooses to continue to stand behind the secret curtain.

Just my opinion

Kelle,


these accusations are being directed at Amber..Again. I have been to her home, stayed there last Dec for the Euk invitational. 4 days I was there, and not a stacked crate to be seen. No, there wasn't 20 dogs either. These people have NEVER been there, so who should you believe?

Carla,

And you've never questioned why that is?? Do you simply believe that she is a innocent target? I don't pretend to have any love for her but there are reasons for that. I can't respect someone that, from what I've seen twists the truth in her own defense. Not to rehash an old topic but as an example; do you remember the picture of her on the Jimtown kennels website holding a grey pug? But yet she claimed she didn't buy the puppy? The timing appeared to coincide with her "study" of the genetics of silver greys. Was she just visiting and they happened to take a picture of her and place it on their puppy buyer page? And there is alot of other questionable circumstances where she's dodged giving straight answers and rather is secretive and elusive about them. I would think that you would understand why some people that do not know her like you do, would wonder about these things? It would be human nature to do so.

I know she's your BFF so ofcourse it's your job as her best friend to come to her defense. And I have no issues with you Carla, nor am I hell bent on attacking her. But I'm not going to be scolded by her either for replying to a post. And that is how her reply came across to me.

Unfortunately, the masses may not just take your word for it Carla and I bet there are many here who are curious as to why she herself has never stated how many Pugs and Bulldogs she has and has never (that I have seen) posted photos of her set up. Seems that would be an easy cure to these rumors. Maybe I'm just too much of an open book and she and I simply operate on total opposites of the spectrum. No, she's not obligated to do that but she can't keep complaining that she's the victim and a target if she chooses to continue to stand behind the secret curtain.

Just my opinion

Here is what I have learned in this sport: I didn't have it easy when I started with my 1st pug I showed. A local breeder here spread nasty rumors about me, I was a BYB, my dogs were sick and dying and I sold them in the local free newspaper. Not one shred of truth was in this, but she didn't mind spreading lies about someone whom she had never met. NO one but my 2 friends here would have anything to do with me. That is until I worked very hard to prove her wrong, and develop a good reputation. Now when I bought my first girl from DeAnne, I was also invited to be on a chat group monitored by a woman that had a agenda. She took a online post of DeAnne's that simply said she bred champion pugs, and copied and posted a puppy mill's ad that was selling 23 puppies and put it under DeAnne's ad. Making it look like DeAnne had 23 puppies for sale. This was a private list, and no member was allowed to speak about what was posted. so it gave free rein to this person to say what ever the damn hill thing she wanted and the person she was trashing had no knowledge of it. I had a couple of people warn me about DeAnne because they heard she was a puppy mill. Jodi defended DeAnne because this "puppy mill" breeder has sold me a puppy that won grand sweeps at the first specialty I went to. Jodi was removed from the list.
Now this was a long time ago, so lets bring it up to the present: Kelle, there is rumors being told about you as I write this. I heard some at nationals in fact. I bet there is rumors about me too. But here is how I handle this. I hear them out, then I disregard the rumor as just that, a hurtful rumor. Unless I know it to be true, I don't believe it. Now if you hurt my friend directly, you will know it. I will not go behind your back, I will not spread rumors, I will contact you directly. Is Amber my BFF? Amber is a good friend, but see this really has nothing to do with friendship. It has to do with right and wrong. The basis of this rumor about her is from a person that befriended the POC's that she had to go to court against, to win the ability to spay a bitch that could hardly breath. Shame on Amber, to put the dog 1st. So see, the only info they have is from a disgruntled person who lost a lawsuit. Not very good source in my opinion. I have been to her home, I would never lie to save anyone's butt, friend or not. You don't have to like her, she will survive. But learn from my experience and disregard hurtful rumors about our fellow pug people. My start may not have been a easy one, but it has taught me much.

Here is what I have learned in this sport: I didn't have it easy when I started with my 1st pug I showed. A local breeder here spread nasty rumors about me, I was a BYB, my dogs were sick and dying and I sold them in the local free newspaper. Not one shred of truth was in this, but she didn't mind spreading lies about someone whom she had never met. NO one but my 2 friends here would have anything to do with me. That is until I worked very hard to prove her wrong, and develop a good reputation. Now when I bought my first girl from DeAnne, I was also invited to be on a chat group monitored by a woman that had a agenda. She took a online post of DeAnne's that simply said she bred champion pugs, and copied and posted a puppy mill's ad that was selling 23 puppies and put it under DeAnne's ad. Making it look like DeAnne had 23 puppies for sale. This was a private list, and no member was allowed to speak about what was posted. so it gave free rein to this person to say what ever the damn hill thing she wanted and the person she was trashing had no knowledge of it. I had a couple of people warn me about DeAnne because they heard she was a puppy mill. Jodi defended DeAnne because this "puppy mill" breeder has sold me a puppy that won grand sweeps at the first specialty I went to. Jodi was removed from the list.
Now this was a long time ago, so lets bring it up to the present: Kelle, there is rumors being told about you as I write this. I heard some at nationals in fact. I bet there is rumors about me too. But here is how I handle this. I hear them out, then I disregard the rumor as just that, a hurtful rumor. Unless I know it to be true, I don't believe it. Now if you hurt my friend directly, you will know it. I will not go behind your back, I will not spread rumors, I will contact you directly. Is Amber my BFF? Amber is a good friend, but see this really has nothing to do with friendship. It has to do with right and wrong. The basis of this rumor about her is from a person that befriended the POC's that she had to go to court against, to win the ability to spay a bitch that could hardly breath. Shame on Amber, to put the dog 1st. So see, the only info they have is from a disgruntled person who lost a lawsuit. Not very good source in my opinion. I have been to her home, I would never lie to save anyone's butt, friend or not. You don't have to like her, she will survive. But learn from my experience and disregard hurtful rumors about our fellow pug people. My start may not have been a easy one, but it has taught me much.

Yes, I'm sure a lot of us had rough starts, myself included, but what that has to do with this I'm not sure.

As far as rumors go here is how I view them. It tickles me that folks at Nationals would take the time to talk about me. It means I'm worthy of their time and energy. But it doesn't bother me because I know and understand that people will talk. That just comes with the territory. BUT you don't hear me complaining about it either do you? Or playing the victim.

My goals are a lot lower than yours in what I hope to accomplish in this breed. And I say that not sarcastically at all but the facts are very likely that...I will likely never have number of champions you do, have prestige's wins like you have, or judge someday. Simply because I don't have the time nor a burning desire to do so. I will probably always be small-time, by choice. I love my dogs, enjoy training puppies and love trying to produce the best quality I can. But I also have a busy life outside of the dogs and I hate the political bi-product that comes with showing. So I leave that up to my handler right now. At the end of the day though the talk is just that...talk. Those folks will never have any bearing on my world. I'm not interested in a popularity contest and if people don't like me, I'm fine with that. Here is the point though: If I'm giving them a reason to talk...it's certainly not because I have my picture on a puppymill site holding a grey Pug puppy that I supposedly did not purchase. It's things like that I'm referring to that were evaded. I am not doing questionable things like that and then playing victim when the rumors fly.

The difference between Amber and myself is I am an open book. Ask me and I'll tell you. I don't purposefully hide things or try diversion tactics when faced with rumors or questioned about things. I have 7 Pugs (including a spayed pet) and right now; 2 puppies (possibly a few more on the way), and you all have seen pictures of my set up. All this info is also on my website and blog. I'll tell you the faults of every single dog I have as I see them. I'm not riding on anyone's coat tails in order to further myself in this breed nor am I laying on the flattery of a mentor every chance I get that is so thick it drips like honey, though it comes across sickeningly sweet. I have no hidden agenda with anyone and I don't use other people in a purposeful way to better my own position. That is why I say she and I are on opposite ends of the spectrum. I'm forthcoming. She is not from what I've seen.

IMO, it's not how you start out. It's how you choose to walk the journey. I'm very comfortable in the journey I am on and certainly don't need anyone to validate that for me. Nor do I put myself in situations where I'm constantly questioned or need to defend rumors. Shoot, the ones about myself...I never hear about anyway. And if I do hear about them it would probably bring a bit of humor to my day.

~Yes, I'm sure a lot of us had rough starts, myself included, but what that has to do with this I'm not sure.~

I wrote about my start so you can understand why I defend those that at attacked.


~As far as rumors go here is how I view them. It tickles me that folks at Nationals would take the time to talk about me. It means I'm worthy of their time and energy. But it doesn't bother me because I know and understand that people will talk. That just comes with the territory. BUT you don't hear me complaining about it either do you? Or playing the victim.~

YOU are not being attacked on a public board are you? Slightly different situation. And by a faceless person that is too big of a coward to come on with their real name. What do they have to hide from?

I don't need anyone to validate what I do, I have done well without the support from my peers. and if Amber is grateful for the help I have given her, who here needs or deserves to judge her?
I happy to always give credit when credit is due. I didn't get here without help from DeAnne Little and Carol Giles, and make sure they know how special they are to me. No one is a island onto themselves. We would not be where we are without the ones who created this wonderful breed before us. We are simply caretakers of them. I always keep that in mind so I never get "too big for my britches" so to speak. What I can't understand is if you don't like her posts, no one is holding a gun to your head and making you read them.


~As far as rumors go here is how I view them. It tickles me that folks at Nationals would take the time to talk about me. It means I'm worthy of their time and energy~
Oh, you weren't the only one being talked about. But the other one I heard about I happen to believe every word since I have my own dealings with her.

YOU are not being attacked on a public board are you? Slightly different situation. And by a faceless person that is too big of a coward to come on with their real name. What do they have to hide from?

YES I have Carla and more than once! You don't remember the most recent post by a faceless person that was directed towards me on the "First pictures of Tiggy's baby" thread?

"You have bumped this pup or had it bumped several times cute, as it may be, you have another litter due in days, which means more advertising? You are a breeder, I get it. Personally, I feel that you need to advertise your puppies on the show breeder websites of which you belong to, or,advertise your litters in your various club publications. Why should the Pug Meet Up board also be used by the same few,annually, or even bi-annually as a breeder's sales tool? Spamming?"

My response was not evasive, but instead clear and honest (with a little sarcasm thrown in for good measure).

I don't need anyone to validate what I do, I have done well without the support from my peers. and if Amber is grateful for the help I have given her, who here needs or deserves to judge her?
I happy to always give credit when credit is due. I didn't get here without help from DeAnne Little and Carol Giles, and make sure they know how special they are to me. No one is a island onto themselves. We would not be where we are without the ones who created this wonderful breed before us. We are simply caretakers of them. I always keep that in mind so I never get "too big for my britches" so to speak. What I can't understand is if you don't like her posts, no one is holding a gun to your head and making you read them.

Like I said, I too don't need anyone to validate what I do either. I understand what you are saying in regards to why we defend those that are new, we all start somewhere, etc., however that wasn't even what this topic was about. Who you choose to keep company with and defend is up to you. Just like it would be up to me with anyone I am friends with. But I would have a hard time defending someone who repeatedly has involved themselves in what appeared to be questionable situations and then they avoided responding clearly when asked about them.

As far as if I don't like her post, don't to read them....Most of the time I don't except it is more difficult when she posts on the threads that I start. Makes it a bit difficult to simply skip over hers. Trust me if there was the option to "ignore" someone on here I'd be using it. But then here is the flip side to that. If she knows she's a repeated target here why on earth does she continue to post here?? Why set yourself up like that? Maybe she enjoys it.

The bottom line is she's not doing herself any favors by her evasiveness or attempts to redirect incoming questions. It hasn't only been these faceless people Carla that have questioned her actions. You know that. She has never been 100% direct with anyone else on here either from what I can see. I notice you didn't comment about the Jimtown issue. And you are certainly not obligated to. But a lot of times silence speaks the loudest. I think there is a difference between judging someone and forming a personal opinion about someone's actions. I have a personal opinion. It's not my job to judge. What's that saying? "It will all (truth) come out in the wash eventually". So it's not my mission to dig up any truth on Amber. Eventually it will come out anyway. And hopefully we'll all be wrong, none of those things will have any truth to them and I will be the first to offer a humble apology. Because I am certainly not above admitting when I'm wrong.

Oh, you weren't the only one being talked about. But the other one I heard about I happen to believe every word since I have my own dealings with her.

And you can bet I won't be the last one talked about either. This kind of stuff goes on all the time. I think we ALL have been talked about or will be at one time or another.

YOU are not being attacked on a public board are you? Slightly different situation. And by a faceless person that is too big of a coward to come on with their real name. What do they have to hide from?

YES I have Carla and more than once! You don't remember the most recent post by a faceless person that was directed towards me on the "First pictures of Tiggy's baby" thread?

"You have bumped this pup or had it bumped several times cute, as it may be, you have another litter due in days, which means more advertising? You are a breeder, I get it. Personally, I feel that you need to advertise your puppies on the show breeder websites of which you belong to, or,advertise your litters in your various club publications. Why should the Pug Meet Up board also be used by the same few,annually, or even bi-annually as a breeder's sales tool? Spamming?"

My response was not evasive, but instead clear and honest (with a little sarcasm thrown in for good measure).

I don't need anyone to validate what I do, I have done well without the support from my peers. and if Amber is grateful for the help I have given her, who here needs or deserves to judge her?
I happy to always give credit when credit is due. I didn't get here without help from DeAnne Little and Carol Giles, and make sure they know how special they are to me. No one is a island onto themselves. We would not be where we are without the ones who created this wonderful breed before us. We are simply caretakers of them. I always keep that in mind so I never get "too big for my britches" so to speak. What I can't understand is if you don't like her posts, no one is holding a gun to your head and making you read them.

Like I said, I too don't need anyone to validate what I do either. I understand what you are saying in regards to why we defend those that are new, we all start somewhere, etc., however that wasn't even what this topic was about. Who you choose to keep company with and defend is up to you. Just like it would be up to me with anyone I am friends with. But I would have a hard time defending someone who repeatedly has involved themselves in what appeared to be questionable situations and then they avoided responding clearly when asked about them.

As far as if I don't like her post, don't to read them....Most of the time I don't except it is more difficult when she posts on the threads that I start. Makes it a bit difficult to simply skip over hers. Trust me if there was the option to "ignore" someone on here I'd be using it. But then here is the flip side to that. If she knows she's a repeated target here why on earth does she continue to post here?? Why set yourself up like that? Maybe she enjoys it.

The bottom line is she's not doing herself any favors by her evasiveness or attempts to redirect incoming questions. It hasn't only been these faceless people Carla that have questioned her actions. You know that. She has never been 100% direct with anyone else on here either from what I can see. I notice you didn't comment about the Jimtown issue. And you are certainly not obligated to. But a lot of times silence speaks the loudest. I think there is a difference between judging someone and forming a personal opinion about someone's actions. I have a personal opinion. It's not my job to judge. What's that saying? "It will all (truth) come out in the wash eventually". So it's not my mission to dig up any truth on Amber. Eventually it will come out anyway. And hopefully we'll all be wrong, none of those things will have any truth to them and I will be the first to offer a humble apology. Because I am certainly not above admitting when I'm wrong.

Oh, you weren't the only one being talked about. But the other one I heard about I happen to believe every word since I have my own dealings with her.

And you can bet I won't be the last one talked about either. This kind of stuff goes on all the time. I think we ALL have been talked about or will be at one time or another.

~YES I have Carla and more than once! You don't remember the most recent post by a faceless person that was directed towards me on the "First pictures of Tiggy's baby" thread?~

Was that last week when I was gone? I don't remember it, but I guess you now know how it feels?

As far as Amber being secretive, this is very interesting to say the least. She has repeatedly posted pictures of her crib, her living room and all the dogs hanging out. She has not posted pictures of her "set up" for a really good reason, she has none. She doesn't have kennels, or dog runs. She has a house with 3 bedrooms and a back yard. The garage is full of her remodel projects, not dog crates stacked. If you are interested in seeing her dogs, she has been on her web site. She isn't hiding anything. As far as the grey pug, I don't remember her denying that she bought her, she just didnt' say anything either way. She did buy her and she is a spayed pet living with her parents. Amber is at a cat show this weekend, so the reason I chose to not say anything about the gray pug was I would let her. But sense you insinuated that my silence on it means something more I will put my 2 cents in.

You know this troll got exactly what she wanted, the meet up in turmoil again. Is this the same troll that attacked you Kelle?

I just want to say that this person ( Who most of us know who she is) got what she wants, she wanted the Friday night drama and she almost getting it. Let this thread die.....................

Man I thought I email the Meet Up about this Sam Adams and her IP address and so forth